When "rights" become "Wrong"....

Published on December 16, 2005 By KarmaGirl In Life Journals

Since I am lazy, I am going to paste a copy of an IRC conversation that I just had:

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<KarmaGirl> last night on the news, there were two women fined $400 each for praying in the courtyard of their apartment complex. I guess it's not public property, so the apartment complex says their is no "free speech" and that the women were violating other renters rights.
<KarmaGirl> Is that wacked, or what?
<Cordelia> that is completely whacked
<Zoomba> wow
<Zoomba> talk about taking things WAY too far
<Cordelia> I'm not a Christian but I just don't get offended when people pray. Why would it be offensive?
<KarmaGirl> I don't know.
<Zoomba> because everyone's so oversensitive right now... the land lord was probably afraid he'd get fined or sued for it so he tried to fine the prayers to nip the problem in the bud
<Cordelia> Were they screaming or something? Praying is usually something that's fairly quiet and innocuous.
<KarmaGirl> last I checked, the US was still primarily Christian. With a "majority rules" system (as is the context of the constitution) it seems quite "wrong"
<Cordelia> I'll say.
<KarmaGirl> no, they were praying outloud (saying their rosary or something) loud enough to hear, but they weren't trying to solicit others to join in.
<Cordelia> If they were harassing people, defacing property, blocking public paths while praying...ok then. But just praying?
<Cordelia> I mean, what if people sat in the courtyard and talked? Wouldn't that be the same level of noise "voilation" (or lack thereof).
<Cordelia> Stupid country.
<KarmaGirl> I guess we better stop saying "bless you" when somebody sneezes. It could cost you $400.
<Cordelia> How about "Holy crap". Is that ok?
<Zoomba> America, where freedom of speech and freedom of religion really means Freedom From Being Offended...
<KarmaGirl> They said it was a violation because it was religious. They even showed the judge talking who said that praying needs to be kept "private" and gave suggestions of praying at home or at church only.
<Zoomba> as a measure to ensure that no one is offended, starting immediately everyone must wear the same clothing, eat the same food, living in identical homes and drive identical cars
<Zoomba> wow, that judge is a moron
<KarmaGirl> I wonder if it would have been an issue if it didn't happen during the holidays
<KarmaGirl> the judge was reported to be Jewish (not sure if that is a factor)
<Zoomba> I wish people Merry Christmas... if they are gonna get bent out of shape about that, screw 'em
<KarmaGirl> I figure that, since Christmas is a Government Holiday, nobody should be getting offended by it. If they do, move someplace that has a different government
<Cordelia> Well, it's a sad commentary when such a thing as the judge being jewish is used to call a ruling he has made into question.
<Zoomba> and if they're offended by it, they need to get their head examined
<KarmaGirl> I'm not Christian, but I wouldn't ahve a problem with hearing somebody pray (in any religion).
<KarmaGirl> What about church bells? you can hear them for miles. Should they get fined since I can hear them on private property and they are trying to attract people to a Christian church? When does it stop?
<KarmaGirl> I guess I should blog about this. Maybe I should just copy and paste this IRC conversation.....
<Zoomba> lol
<KarmaGirl> I'm not correcting typos, either....
<Zoomba> Personally, I think the current crusade against all things religious is just as bad as a state sponsored religion... Atheism is just as much a religion as Islam or Christianity or Judaism
<Cordelia> I got married in a hotel and before I walked out ("down the aisle") some women who were there for a religious conference stepped out and saw me and immediately prayed for me and my marriage. Far from being offended (or bursting into flame) I actually felt quite honored. They saw me there and did what they could for me - something very nice.
<Zoomba> yeah, it showed they cared
<Cordelia> I di dfind a GREAT article by Penn Gillette on going 'beyond atheism'
<Cordelia> http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5015557
<Cordelia> oops *Jillette

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So, JU, what do you think?

Comments

jlaur65

on Dec 16, 2005

I'm new to JU, and i don't know how to do quotes, so i guess i'll just copy and paste.

"I guess we better stop saying "bless you" when somebody sneezes. It could cost you $400."

HAHA. that is very true, and i wonder if it would ever get that bad. i could see it happening in a few years if we continue down this trend we're on. it seems like every year, especially around the holidays, everyone gets super sensitive. but the only people they're concerned are offending others is the christians it seems. maybe because there's more Christians, than Jewish or Muslim. they don't worry about offending people when they pass laws legalizing gay marriage and abortion, but they're quick to notice that someone might get upset if a person were to pray where others who don't agree with their religion would see.

it's freedom OF religion, not freedom FROM religion.

Trudygolightly

on Dec 16, 2005

I hope the landlord gets sued, by the Human Rights Dept., and loses his job.

He's clearly infriging on the renter's rights to freedom of speech, IMHO

Dr Guy

on Dec 16, 2005

What do I think? I think my respect for Cordelia just went up more (it was already high)!

As far as this, the courts could not enter into unless someone in the apartment complex called and complained about disturbing the peace, since it was private property. And at the trial, they should have been able to confront the person. If it was the landlord, I would counter sue him for restriction of the lease that was not stated before the lease was signed.

And I think the whole episode is Petty and stupid! God Bless you!

Ok, Zoomba, where do I send my $400?

Zoomba

on Dec 16, 2005

Ok, Zoomba, where do I send my $400?

Why, to me of course!

Dr Guy

on Dec 16, 2005

Why, to me of course!

What a conservative thing to say!

Cordelia

on Dec 16, 2005

I think my respect for Cordelia just went up more (it was already high)!

Why thanks Doc! I like you too.

So, JU, what do you think?

I think I need to make less mistakes when typing!

I keep telling myself that those women had to have been doing something else to "get in trouble". I mean really, is it this bad? God, please tell me they were defacing the place while praying or something!

Oh wait, that was praying right there, wasn't it? Shame on me.

Not to get too far off topic, but:

I'm new to JU, and i don't know how to do quotes

Welcome jlaur65! Because you were the first responder, the quote button (the small 'Q' in the lower left corner of each comment screen) was not available to you. You can create quotes on your own by typing [ then the word quote and then ]. Put that all together with no spaces. End the quote with [ and then /quote and then ].

I hope that makes sense.

Dan Kaschel

on Dec 16, 2005

Dang.

If that was my trial, I'd be flipping out. I don't think I could handle it.

Dan

KarmaGirl

on Dec 16, 2005

If that was my trial, I'd be flipping out. I don't think I could handle it.

You should have seen the two women. They looked liked nuns in street clothes. It was absolutely insane. I have a feeling that judge may regret letting the cameras roll during his hearing.

I mean, when you take the oath to tell the truth, IN A COURT OF LAW, don't you place your hand on a BIBLE?

It's just getting stupid....

stevendedalus

on Dec 17, 2005

the judge was reported to be Jewish (not sure if that is a factor)
Yeah, right.

Thats why I say "DAMN YOU" when people sneeze around me!

I discreetly say...Bless you--you avoid damnation that way. But when they sneeze a second time, I say Dammit, cut that out!

drmiler

on Dec 17, 2005

Thats why I say "DAMN YOU" when people sneeze around me!
I discreetly say...Bless you--you avoid damnation that way. But when they sneeze a second time, I say Dammit, cut that out!

From me they get a quiet "Bless you" until the 3rd one where I say out loud....3rd time the devil gets you.

dharmagrl

on Dec 17, 2005

mean, when you take the oath to tell the truth, IN A COURT OF LAW, don't you place your hand on a BIBLE?

Not necessarily. You don't have to swear on the bible, you can also make an affirmation....basically, you raise your right hand and affirm that you're telling the truth.

I do affirmations all the time when I'm notarizing.

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